Direct & Indirect card advantage
- Brampton Booster
- Jun 25, 2013
- Comment
Direct Card Advantage
What is card advantage and how do you get it? Here is a very simple idea of what that is. The total of all your cards on the field (not in the soul) and in your hand is your current number of usable cards(skimping technicalities). The damage zone, soul, deck and drop zone do not count as part of your count.
So every turn, you draw 1 card. Therefore, you get a +1 in card advantage, because you brought a card from ‘nowhere’ to your hand. Even if it is a game rule/action, a plus is a plus, and a minus like riding a card is still a minus. Of course, the quality of that plus is what you really want, and I have an exception to make sure Gold Paladin doesn’t ‘plus’ like mad.
A card like Blaster Blade or Beserk Dragon instantly kill off a rearguard, a -1 for them (or +1 for you depending on your frame of reference. To make it simple, any minus for the opponent is a plus to you). It takes a Counterblast of 2 and a one-time auto skill. Alfred has an extra counterblast for a +1, but it can be used at any time. These are conditionals, and the quality and quantity of the card advantage is dependent on it. This is all direct card advantage.
Indirect Card Advantage
Let’s see where this advantage case fails. Consider Juggernaut Maximum. When he attacks, he soulblasts, then pops back into the deck. In terms of cards, the owner of said Juggernaut just got a -1. What gives? He blitzkriegs of course, by getting an extra 5000 on the attack forcing the opponent to also lose 1 extra card equaling it out. This is indirect card advantage.
Here is a simple guideline of how much a cost is in terms of a “plus” to the field is. These are not set in stone, as conditionals can affect the cost of the the card greatly. On average however, this is a good approximation based on the card database:
| Cost | Card equivalent | Quick Explanation |
|---|---|---|
| SB1/CB1 | 0.5 | Both Sky Griffon and Minotaur have the same effect but different costs, which means the costs are equal. |
| Rest | 0.5 | Pawn, Cosmo Roar. BTW +2k is about 1/2 a card since 5k constitutes as a +1.. |
| Calling Top card | 0.5 | In games it can be larger or smaller depending on what is actually called. 0.5 is the average. |
| CB2 | 1 | Explained above |
| SB3 | 1 | Yay for Armoured Fairy, Shubiela. The counterblast to soulblast ratio is not fixed, but every counterblast has a soulblast-ish equivalent. |
| +5000POWER | 1 | Promise daughter and Holy diaster dragon show this. |
| +Critical 1 | 1.5 (and more) | Aleph has this. Another comparison is that Daiyuusha’s condition is x2 stronger then Rain’s. |
| [STAND] | 1 | Lion Heat and clones stand 1 for this cost. |
| prevent [STAND] | 1 (and less) | Lady Bomb. Hell Spider. Although standing is strictly better in effects, prevent stand generally have easier conditionals so it gives an akward line of balance for these 2. Check out Illuminal Asure and Mastle Bettle skill’s for comparison. |
| [DRAW] | 1 | This is why I wonder why Draw triggers aren’t 10k. |
| 4th battle | 1 | This is a conditional, but a heavy one. Because apparently it is really hard to get. |
| Limit Break 4 | 1 | Garmore, Cocuytus and Kiriel all get 5000 when attacking, which as I’ve shown before is the same as an extra card. Important: do not use LB4 as a means of making effects stronger, but rather making costs cheaper. Explained a bit later. |
| Persona Blast | 2 | DOTE uses itself to twin drive again to get a +1, same as Chrome Jailer’s second effect. Rivere counterblasts for one 5k, the persona deals the other 2. |
| [HEAL] | 2 | Yes. Healing is at least twice as good as all the any other trigger. This should be the one that gets hit with a 5k shield drop. |
| Limit Break 5 | 3 | The 3 units currently clearly give an insane bonus for being one away from death. |
| Break Ride 4 | 3 | I have no ***ching clue, but it ranges from +2 to +5, so I settle for +3. |
Limit Breaks are conditionals and counterblasts at the same time. The better way to think about limit breaks as a way of making costs cheaper. So a Counterblast 4 technique (+2) becomes a LB4 Counterblast 2. In that sense, Counterblasts of 4 or 5 should be impossible even with LB, as that would mean the original skill was a CB7. (And it should stay that way)
Triggers give 5000 power with is already a +1. It also has an additional effect that gives an advantage around 1-2. Interestingly, since a trigger is likely to appear every two turns, you are also getting at least a +1 in that accord as well. So in direct card advantage, you get +3 every turn, but in indirect card advantage, you get a +4.
Advantage of each Trigger
People might feel good that draw triggers are only 5k, but I believe they can be 10k without being too bad. On average it gives another \5/, bringing the total defense to \15/. But that should make sense as you are drawing a card. A plus corresponds to both 5k power and 5k defense. Since on hit effects like Lion Heat has the same conditional as Apollon, a Stand and a Draw are equal. But since draws are not \10\ but rather \5/, you lost one of your pluses and that makes draws much weaker. (+1+1-1=1) Since Stand Triggers do not lose shield it is a net 2 (+1+1=2).
Critical Triggers on the other hand provides 1.5 cards. Aleph is clear to show that one counterblast gives Aleph 3000POWER, while his other three gives a critical. A CB3 is a high quality card. Another way to look at it is saying that the counterblast 4 is a -2. 0.5 give the power, 1.5 gives the critical. Since Bushiroad favors a fast paced game and no card has \7500/, \5/ or \10/ is acceptable for Criticals and so a crit is regarded as a +1. Note that a crit also becomes on the level of [DRAW] once the opponent is sent to 5 damage. (+1+1.5=2.5)
We only have 2 units that actively heal. Ergodiel needs a Counterblast of 2 (which means 1) and a Persona. Ignoring the counterblast, the persona’s 2 cards is subverted into healing just one card. So it seems that 1 healed card is worth 2. CEO are Lohengrin are V/R > V/R, giving [+5]. Pacificia happens to be a R > V, giving 3 HQ cards and standing [+7.5]. Finally, Feather Palace is V > V, which is by extrapolation a [+10]. (+1+2=+3)
Here is another proof to show the power of heals and the advantage of crits. Given a tree for guarding depending on a 20|20|20 set up on a 10k, extending it too all possibilities you will find that the cards saved per damage is roughly 2(taking 0,4,8,12 and 16 crit). So healing will allow you to ‘save’ 2 cards. Crits can deal 2 damage so it gets a +2 in cards saved, but in damage you still get a 55% chance of counter triggering and make the turn total to ~oneish.
So I conclude to say that heals are broken (Crits and Heals) and they should be the ones that should be hit by 5000. But no, draws get it because it LOOKS like they are better. Unless there happens to be a sporadic start of abusive effects of draws in the coming sets (like a Waterfowl that works in rear-guard or something), the Direct Hand Advantage they acquire is not enough to justify the shield loss. Heals do have a restriction so I guess that is fine, but critical triggers are rampant enough that it’ll be unwise to run lower numbers. If criticals become \5/, then you make them into double-edged swords, making them more interesting.
Since the game is not built so, I bend you to run the highest number of HEALS you can possibly fit, and fill the remaining with criticals. Honestly, only a couple of builds run other ratios. As a not all future calculations in advantage assumes all triggers are net +2. It is close enough and makes calculations much easier.
Ranking
[HEAL]
[CRIT]
[STAND]
[DRAW]
Self Standing Vanguards
So talking about standing, lets do some examples on using the chart.
Dragonic overlord THE END gets a plus in raw numbers; Drop 1 and twin drive again (+1).
But is it a plus if you factor the skill ‘indirectly’? We can break down its skill to get a number, by subtracting the cost from the effect.:
{Stand + Twin Drive(included because it is not normal)} – {CB2 + Persona}
If we get the average numbers into the equation:
{1 + 2} – {1 + 2} = {3} – {3} = 0
Would you look at that! It looks you get nothing. Oh wait, silly me. I forgot to add in two sets of trigger checks.
{4} – {3} = 1
Since DOTE gets the same draw and drive as other grade 3’s, I just subtract them and get the plus OVER an average grade 3’s turn. So ya, DOTE is still an abomination by large. While we are at it, let’s look at some other self standers.
Stern Blaukruger
{Stand 2 + SingleDrive (Chance is now 1/3 instead of 1/2)} – {CB2 + Drop 2}
{2 + 2/3} – {1 + 2} = -0.33333
So Stern is a minus. Don’t let that fool you though, becuase Stern can bulldoze its way into a premature end.
Spectral Duke Dragon
(Stand + Single) – (Retire 3 + CB2)
(1 + 2/3) – (3 + 1) = -2.33333
Straight up OUCH. I hope being able to activate it whenever is worth all that minus.
Eradicator, Dragonic Descendant
(Stand + Twin + Crit) – (CB1 + Drop 3)
(1+1+1) – (0.5 + 3) = -0.5
Dauntless Drive Dragon (break ride given skill ONLY)
(Stand + Twin) – (Drop 3)
(1+1) – (3) = -1
Like the first ‘bad’ break ride? Maybe, if you didn’t look at the +1 from the ride itself and the potential combos.
So why do people run self-standers then? The reason is damage and pressure. Remember, these numbers are only considering yourself. While you may -0.5 from Descendant, the opponent may need to use up an additional 1.5(1 if no trigger first time, 2 if trigger first time) cards in hand to stop the second attack. This then makes Descendant a +1. As you can see, these numbers are inside a ‘vacuum'; the numbers are dynamic with regards to any given scenario. Should you ignore this? No! Say I threaded these numbers into a computer AI engine. It will use this base and compare it to the situation and map out the best path. In fact, most effects are vaccum minuses. This is not a mistake. Therefore, you can appreciate how easy it is to see that DOTE is broken, vacuum or not.
Self Sufficiency
So you swing with a 53k Ezel. Big deal, I perfect guard it. Actually, many effects are ‘useless’ due to perfect guards, like Dark Lord of the Abyss. It doesn’t however, change the fact that it is costed as such. Just because Raptor Colonel can go up to 43000, it doesn’t mean it should be free. It still needs a Limit Break restriction, blowing up 2 rear-guards, AND require a counterblast.
For a unit to be self-sufficient, the raw advantage you gain from the effect should be at least equal to the cost payed or more. So checking Colonel, we take a normal case where we kill off a column:
LB4 + CB1 + Retire 2 = 16000
1+0.5+2 = 3
3.5 > 3
So Colonel is not self-supportive at this level. But what if we pump it up to 20000? Then it becomes 3.5 < 4. So Colonel is self-sufficient at this point. To get 20k, that would mean you have to kill the front row to use it without penalty. Attacking rearguards then vanguard though isn’t the best and just makes it begging for a perfect guard to the face. Another option is to have Beamptero as one of the boosters and MegaRex as the attacker. This is the better option, and is why Colonel decks should maximize the -tero series. Sure, it can still be blocked by a perfect but regardless of whatever actual games throws at us self-sufficiency is on a vacuum level.